I Don’t Know Why I Keep Doing This

It depresses me to realize that there are *still* feminists who think that people like me are simply misguided tools of the patriarchy, and that people like my partner are misogynistic rapists who should kill themselves.

It depresses me to realize that nothing I can possibly say will ever convince them otherwise.

It further depresses me that they can get away with as much ridicule and condemnation of my sexuality as they want in the name of “examining” it or “considering the implications” of it, and will then have the audacity to say that they’re not trying to blame me or tell me that I should stop having sex.

And it really depresses me that I’ll probably never be able to keep myself from engaging with them and getting so pissed off about it that I stay up hours after I should be in bed trying to find some way to make them understand.

I need to remember that this is the Internet, and that blogs like the one I linked to above are not representative of all feminists everywhere. But it still scares me. This sort of thing is what sends me running back into the closet every time I start to feel like I might be able to handle living a life in which I’m completely open about who I am and what I want.

(More discussion on Nine-Deuce’s posts are over at SM-Feminist, here and here.)

8 comments so far

  1. lissy on

    I’d say don’t lose any sleep…but I too have stayed up too late struggling to find words. I too get pissed off but then I remind myself that it is the internet and that I’m ‘out’ to my workmates and friends, who are all feminists, and the most adverse reaction was “Whatever floats your boat Lis.”

  2. Meta on

    I clicked on that link, spent the day trying to justify myself, then came to the same conclusion you did that it wasn’t worth it. Last time I do that. I’m planning to respond on my blog, and I’ll include a link to this post.

  3. violacious on

    Yeah, I’m with you there. Condemning people’s—especially womens’—enjoyment of bdsm seems to me akin to cutting off one’s nose to spite one’s face, given that coming to terms with and enthusiastically pursuing my joy in bdsm is one of the more self-centred and feminist things I’ve done. If my opinion doesn’t count, however, I’m not going to bother to keep talking.

    I just went back to see how the comment thread on the kink.com post has been developing, and the arguments put forth by meta, nic, michael_X, firefey, forelock and clarisse are thought-provoking and reasonable, whereas the commentary from the “opposition” as it’s set itself up to be–just seems to have become rancorous and inane. Sad.

  4. Natalie on

    Sometimes I think people totally miss the concept of freedom of choice. Everything is right and perfect so long as it’s something I’m into, but everyone else’s thing has to pass the my smell test. It is to laugh.

    And let’s face it; why do we really need to justify ourselves?

  5. subversive_sub on

    @Natalie: Well, to be fair to 9-2, she specifically says that she *doesn’t* think everything that’s not BDSM is right and perfect, but just that because BDSM seems more extreme and its imagery more immediately disturbing than with vanilla sex, it warrants special investigation. I disagree with her approach (I think that spending way more thought on the problems found within a minority community that you don’t belong to rather than the problems found in our culture/society as a whole is a bad use of time and energy) but I don’t think she’s claiming her own sexual and relationship practices get a free pass and ours don’t.

    I think that from the radfem perspective, they demand that kinky folk justify themselves because they earnestly believe that BDSM is helping to uphold the patriarchy. Because of this, things like “consent” or “choice” don’t matter to them — they don’t care if we consent to BDSM, because they see it as something that is *inherently* patriarchal and that will continue to oppress women with or without the consent of those involved.

    That’s why I’m starting to think that when engaging with folks of that persuasion, using the “feminism is about choice” line is never, ever going to move them. More on this in my next post, though…

  6. Natie on

    I have to agree with a couple of your points, but particularly your comment, “That’s why I’m starting to think that when engaging with folks of that persuasion, using the “feminism is about choice” line is never, ever going to move them.” Absolutley true! There is no logic involved with this discussion. Rather, it is straight from the gut and anything about freedom of choice is relegated to reproductive choices and thats it.

    The first time I spoke out at a meeting in favor of freedom of sexuality, I shook and peed my pants, because there was a really large degree of dislike in that room. I told that BDSM was akin to pedophilia, rape and all other ugly and non-con activities. I tried to point out bdsm must be con or it is not bdsm (the whole argument by definition thingy, like they say it is enharently patriarchial), but nope, nothing.

    And it is particularly painful for female doms. I was actually told I was “trying to assume the patriarchial role” and all that fine BS!

  7. ranat on

    “I think that spending way more thought on the problems found within a minority community that you don’t belong to rather than the problems found in our culture/society as a whole is a bad use of time and energy[.]”

    YES. That.

    Everyonestarvingthirstinggettingblownuprapedforrealenslaved– Wait! Look! BDSM! Let’s talk about how *that* shouldn’t exist.

  8. […] about it is because this is the second time I’ve run across her expounding her views on kink, via Subversive Sub, and I took a pass the first time. The thought of actually having the kind of conversations that […]


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